Learning the Language of a Healthy Relationship with Food with Brooke Simonson

Paul Salter:

Hey Brooke, thank you so much for joining me. How are you today?

Brooke Simonson:

I’m doing well, Paul. Thanks for having me.

Paul Salter:

Absolutely. And I know I’ve already have mentioned this in the intro, but I can’t help but say it again. It’s really neat to come full circle, having the opportunity to be a guest on your show and boom, here we are again like a year later.

Brooke Simonson:

I know. It is fun because sometimes you meet people for the first time and you don’t know what to expect, but we’re old friends, so it’s going to be a fun conversation.

Paul Salter:

It absolutely is. And the real reason you’re here is just we align so much on how much we really, I think most importantly, care about the actual results and wellbeing of those we’re fortunate enough to work with. But then really taking a sustainable approach or filtering all of our decisions through that lens of sustainability. And I love what you do, your podcast too, The Health Investment, is a badass podcast. So excited to pick that apart and dig a little deeper into learning about that as well in today’s conversation.

Brooke Simonson:

Yeah, for sure. I have to say, I follow you very closely on social media and so many times you post something and I’m like, oh man, that is so good. It’s something I’ve thought, but the way you word it, I don’t know. I always judge myself very harshly on social media and the comparison trap falls into place. But you have some really, really cool content, I must say.

Paul Salter:

Oh, well thank you for that. I appreciate that. And let’s just dive in, tell our listeners a little bit more about who is Brooke, and how did you get to what you’re doing now?

Brooke Simonson:

It was a windy road, I will say. I did not start out in the nutrition and weight loss space. I actually started out teaching middle school originally and then I moved into high school, English specifically. And throughout my beginning of my teaching career, I was in my 20s right after college and just started to go through a lot of, I don’t want to say health struggles because it’s not that I had chronic conditions or anything really pressing where I was in doctor’s offices all the time. But I did struggle with gaining about 20 pounds after college. I felt very tired and sluggish. I thought maybe this is just what happens when you start working and you are 9:00 to 5:00 every day, grinding it out. But it felt weird. It didn’t feel like I should be this tired in my 20s.

I was constantly hungry. I joke that I would carry emergency snacks with me, which at the time were pretzels, ROLD GOLD, small bags of pretzels and usually an apple. And the hanger would hit and if I didn’t have one of those things handy, look out because I was cranky and irritable and I just couldn’t really get a grasp of what was going on. But the weight gain really bugged me most and I figured it was contributing to some of those other symptoms. And much like I’m sure your audience and mine can relate, I tried all of the things. So I tried cutting out carbs and sugar at one point, cutting out processed foods, exercising incessantly, which at the time was 45 plus minutes on the elliptical at the gym that I hated, juice cleanses, trying to have better willpower and self-control. I did all of the things, but nothing ever worked long term.

So I would drop five, maybe 10 pounds, feel really excited, but then I always gained them back and then some because the things I was doing weren’t sustainable. Especially the crazy gym sessions, the juice cleanses. I was pretty miserable and just confused and frustrated. And again, talking to clients now, and I’m sure you hear this all the time, this is what a lot of people are still going through and they describe as the yo-yo or the rollercoaster. It sucks when you’re in the thick of it. And I, at one point, looked around and I thought, I’m an educated person, I feel like I can figure this out. Other people are out there doing this. And by this I mean losing weight and keeping it off and sustaining the results. So if it’s possible for somebody, I feel like it should be possible for me.

And I decided I need to go on more of a research track and follow the science rather than just what’s trending right now in terms of the latest detox or whatever. So I really made researching nutrition and health and weight loss topics my hobby and my passion project. And I found really reputable podcasts, I read books, I learned how to dive into articles on PubMed. And eventually, I enrolled in the Institute of Transformational Nutrition to become certified as a nutrition coach, which is where I eventually got that certification, all the time, still teaching. So you have to think during free periods, I always joke that if my former principal were to hear me on podcasts, he would think what the heck was going on? But I was supposed to be grading papers and planning lessons, which I of course was still doing, but I was so much more interested in everything I was learning about nutrition and health and weight loss. And I started a blog and on weekends and nights, I devoted all of my time to just really getting my hands on any information I could.

And eventually I was able to follow the science and figure out evidence-based changes to make to my nutrition and lifestyle habits so I could drop the 20 pounds for good. I started to feel healthier and more confident and more energized in my late 20s and early 30s than I did when I was 21. And ultimately, I think the best result is I was able to ditch restrictive dieting and enjoy all foods without guilt, which I think is the best results. And it’s especially just the no guilt part to be able to have a cupcake here and there or a cookie or whatever it is that you enjoy because food can bring so much enjoyment. It’s fuel, but it’s also social. And we’re recording this in the holidays. There’s so many customs and celebrations around food and it’s just terrible to be in that spot when you feel like you have to be all or nothing or on or off a diet. And once you figure out the sustainable path to your success and what works for you, there’s nothing better.

Paul Salter:

I love that. Maybe perhaps the most important question I ask you today, what is your favorite food?

Brooke Simonson:

Okay, so I’m more of a savory person than a sweets person. And so I gravitate towards nachos whenever I can get my hands on nachos. But they have to be really good because I feel like some nachos are not awesome. But if you find fantastic nachos, I would say that’s a favorite.

Paul Salter:

Okay, so are we talking obviously the perfect amount of salt on these chips and we’re having some kind of pulled pork or chicken, you’ve got the guac, the Pico, what else am I missing? Salsa, sour cream, lettuce, beans.

Brooke Simonson:

Yeah, so I’m a bit of a nacho snob and at this point I’ve decided I’ve had too many soggy nachos. So when you get the salsa or something like sour cream on the nachos, the ratio can be off. So I will typically get, it comes with the beans, the chicken, the guac, that’s all fine, but I’ll ask for the salsa and the sour cream on the side. And that can be a game changer because then you control the amount and there’s no soggy chips.

Paul Salter:

I love it. So the title of this episode will definitely feature a highlight on a crash course for nacho building, very, very good. I made nachos last week and I’m thinking, okay, yep, could have put the salsa on the side, so future note for next time.

Brooke Simonson:

Yeah, you’re welcome, everyone. You heard in here first.

Paul Salter:

I love that. So what I really stands out to me about your journey, and I appreciate you sharing that, is just this insatiable hunger for knowledge. You being in the education realm, literally realizing like, oh my gosh, I have this thirst for knowledge already. Let me go utilize this skillset and this power I have to better myself. But one of the most cliché quotes thrown out there as knowledge is power. But I think you and I will both agree when I say knowledge is power only if there is action. So looking back, what do you think was one of the primary catalysts for you to not only go get that knowledge but start implementing and applying what you were learning?

Brooke Simonson:

For sure. I think there’s different types of people out there and there’s, I think, go-getter action takers and that is me, I would say. In everything in life, if I find something, I just take action and that’s one of my strengths. And then I of course have many weaknesses, but that’s a strength of mine of getting knowledge and then taking action. And that has been the case throughout my life. My parents were number ones that had to make me study or I was the one who was putting pressure on myself to get the essay done sooner. If it’s due next week, I’ll do it today and I’m going to study extra for this math test and get the tutor and make the flashcards.

I just have always been an action taker, but I 1,000% agree with you that it’s not always easy to take the action, that’s the hardest part, is taking the action. And I think though, it is a lot easier when you are taking action that gets you results. And so I would say that was also the difference, is that I was taking action and I didn’t feel like I was doing anything crazy like I had been in the past and it actually felt a lot easier. So then I could stick with the actions better than I could when I was doing the cutting out all carbs or the elliptical sessions or the juice cleanses. And that is something that clients say to me often, I’m sure they say to you as well, of it just feels easier and I didn’t realize you could lose weight and live your life and keep the weight off and not have to go to these crazy extremes. And that, I think, was the biggest eye-opener for me.

Paul Salter:

Looking back. Is there one particular action that you took that stands out among the others that once you started implementing, gave you a massive return on your investment, so to speak, to keep that momentum and whatnot going forward?

Brooke Simonson:

Yes. I would say kind of a two-parter. So first of all, focusing on what to add into my diet rather than what to take out. And so for about 10 years I would say I was just focusing on don’t eat carbs, don’t eat sugar, don’t eat packaged food, don’t eat nachos. And it felt really, really tough. And then when I started realizing if you take this additive approach and you focus on what to add and you work on the quality of what you’re adding in. So for example, protein or produce to a meal, then you’re feeling more full because of the protein and the fiber and then you’re naturally eating less because you’re feeling full. And so that was the biggest thing for me of just when I focus on, for example, making protein the star of every meal.

And I still do that to this day of, let’s say my husband and I decide we want to have pasta, my first thought is what’s the protein going to be? And so we look through our freezer, oh, we have some ground beef or we have these frozen chicken breasts and so we thaw those. But I’m just constantly going to put the protein first and then of course, I can add in a veggie or a fruit or something to the meal. But prioritizing what to eat rather than what not to eat. And then the fun foods are able to fit in around the edges because the majority of the time you’re eating nutrient dense foods that help you feel your best and then you have nachos.

Paul Salter:

Yeah, I love that. And it’s so funny in the actual post I published on Instagram today, I talked about addition by subtraction and this is the exact opposite. It’s subtraction by addition. I love that. I think that’s such a neat idea because you’re filling yourself with these nutrient dense protein is incredibly satiating or filling. There’s not as much room all of a sudden for all the other junk that seemed to sneak in there when we weren’t really aware of what we were eating.

Brooke Simonson:

And speaking about knowledge, I didn’t have that knowledge for so many years. So I mentioned to the snack I carried with me was a small bag of ROLD GOLD pretzels and an apple. Fine, pretzels and an apple can fit, but I would eat the pretzels and I would be hungry 20 minutes later. And then I just thought there was something wrong with me constantly, just beating myself up of, “Brooke, you just had pretzels, you can’t possibly be hungry again. What’s wrong with you?”

And just this internal dialogue all the time and realizing then if I were to have some type of protein with that snack, I could feel full for maybe an hour or two and make it till dinner and not feel like this crazy person who can’t get a handle on their hunger. And that’s something a lot of my clients realize of just when I start prioritizing protein, we call it snackiness, it can just dissipate. Especially the between lunch and dinner snackiness or the post dinner snackiness, it just goes away. And then all of a sudden you have this thought of, okay, I wasn’t nuts all those years. There was actual physical hunger I was feeling. It’s not just that I have a problem and I’m the biggest snacker in the world and can’t get a handle on this.

Paul Salter:

Yeah, I may or may not have a bag of chocolate covered pretzels in my fridge, but that’s neither here nor there. On that note, nacho’s, chocolate covered pretzels, those have a special place in my heart. You mentioned some of those treat foods, favorite foods creeping in on the outside, always having room on the edge to still be worked in and included, never being avoided or restricted. But you and I also know that many people listening and even maybe both of us on the occasion still struggle with feeling a little bit of shame or guilt when we eat those foods. So for someone listening who is picking up what you’re throwing down, loves the advice but still doesn’t know how she can start feeling confident in that piece, eating the cupcake, the donut, the chocolate covered pretzels, how would you help her begin releasing some of that guilt and shame around those foods?

Brooke Simonson:

Again, a two-parter. So first of all, realizing the mindset you have right now around food is probably one that you have grown to have over 10, 20, maybe even 30 years. So realizing this is a slow process. The mindset, I’m sure we’re going to talk about mindset, but the mindset stuff is some of the toughest, I would say and the most challenging to work with when you’re on the sustainable weight loss journey. And you don’t undo it overnight. It’s not this two day Amazon Prime shipping, but we live in this immediate world. And so if you continue to have feelings of guilt or shame after eating things, just first of all, understanding any feeling is a normal feeling. There’s nothing wrong with you for feeling that. And this is a work in progress, it’s going to take a long time, it’s going to take practice just like learning a new language, you’re learning a new language around food.

You don’t learn a new language overnight. One actionable strategy that can really be helpful is to stop thinking of foods as good or bad. So to stop thinking apple good, cookie bad, and to instead think that all foods are more nutritious or less nutritious, all foods are more caloric or less caloric. And if you take the emotion out of food, then you typically remove some of the shame about eating certain foods because you’re no longer eating bad foods, you’re just eating something that’s less nutritious and more caloric like a cookie for example. And so then if you eat that, you just think, okay, that wasn’t the most nutrient dense thing, it was delicious. But then at my next meal or snack, can I get something that has a lot of nutrients to balance that off? And you just practice that over and over again.

Paul Salter:

Yeah, beautiful. I love that. And circling back, you mentioned earlier also kind of referring to food as fuel and yeah, we all know physiologically it’s fuel. But there is literally a word soul food or heart food, food serves many, many purposes. So that cupcake or the chocolate cup pretzels, if you’re going to have it, be all in, be present and enjoy every single bite. Don’t half-ass presence, rush through it and then five seconds later feel an incredible amount of guilt and shame. Absolutely enjoy it and indulge intentionally.

Brooke Simonson:

And I think another piece of that that took me a while to learn is delay gratification for the thing that’s truly worth it to you. So for example, I used to just say I love chocolate chip cookies, so I’m not a huge sweets person, but I love a good chocolate chip cookie. But I just thought, I love chocolate chip cookies. So I would eat any chocolate chip cookie that crossed my path because I thought this is my sweet, this is what I like. But then when I got more specific about it, I realized I don’t like all chocolate chip cookies. I like the gooey soft ones, bonus if they have a sprinkle of sea salt, I like them when they’re fresh, they’re homemade maybe at a bakery or maybe somebody makes them. I don’t like the crunchy, stale store bought bagged, CHIPS AHOY, those versions.

And so now I wait for my cookie, if that makes sense. I delay gratification and if I come across… My poor mother-in-law, she made this big batch of chocolate chip cookies when we went to the beach this summer. So kind, she knows I love them. She even said, “This is not my best work.” And I tried to bite and they weren’t that good. And my husband is one of seven, all of his siblings were there. Typically, the sweets go within two days. Days three, four, five the chocolate chip cookies were still sitting on the counter. No one was touching them. But past me would’ve thought, oh my gosh, chocolate chip cookies, those are mine, those are for me. She made them for me and I would’ve eaten more. And I decided this isn’t my truly worth it treat that I want to indulge in and enjoy as you said. And so I’m going to wait for the one that is worth it, truly worth it to me.

Paul Salter:

Yeah, I love that. And I was prepared to say, and I’ll still say that the chewy CHIPS AHOY cookies are one of my favorites, but that’s neither here nor there.

Brooke Simonson:

So I haven’t had those in many years and I honestly forgot they existed. But I think you’re onto something there, I do enjoy those.

Paul Salter:

My go-to is the mega, gigantic stuffed Oreos, but I do like a good chocolate CHIPS AHOY cookie, the soft kind.

Brooke Simonson:

Oh, interesting. So yeah, I’m not an Oreos person-

Paul Salter:

Oh man-

Brooke Simonson:

… and they’ve never done it for me. But again, everybody has their things, right?

Paul Salter:

Yeah, I have the biggest sweet tooth. I’ll be the first to admit I could eat ice cream and Oreos all day, but I wouldn’t be having the energy at 3:26 in the afternoon to have this wonderful conversation. So I make sacrifices.

Brooke Simonson:

Exactly. And I think it’s also helpful to just tune in to how different things make you feel. And these foods we are talking about are delicious, but you typically don’t feel your best if you over-indulge in something like Oreos. And nobody likes to feel gross.

Paul Salter:

Yeah, completely agree.

Brooke Simonson:

Yeah.

Paul Salter:

So let’s build off of that. You’ve mentioned there’s always an emotional component behind this, specifically when food is related. And digging even deeper, there’s an underlying story, a belief more often than not, a limiting belief that is running the narrative and driving the car so to speak, about why we do and don’t take certain actions. So from all of your coaching experience, of course, any of your personal experience, what do you feel are some of the most common beliefs holding people back from truly stepping outside of that restrictive short-term fad diet approach to achieving their goals?

Brooke Simonson:

The all or nothing one is huge because I think every diet I ever tried, and I hear this from clients as well, it’s really all or nothing. So for keto, using that as an example, it’s either you’re cutting out carbs and sugar and focusing on protein and fat. So you’re ‘in ketosis’ and I’m using quotes here or you’re ‘out of ketosis’. And so the whole idea is they don’t want to throw themselves out of ketosis, which usually they’re not even measuring because that’s a whole other thing. But in their mind-

Paul Salter:

So true.

Brooke Simonson:

… it’s like, are you peeing on a stick every day? Maybe not. And some people are, I guess. Some people take it to the nth degree. But this idea that I’m either on keto or I’m off keto, I’m on a diet or I’m off, I’m either eating a cupcake and then I’m off my diet or I’m having no sweets at all and I’m on my diet. And so that’s a really important one to break out of. One I’ve been talking about recently with clients since it is the holidays, is I’ve heard a lot of them saying, “I’m going to my mother-in-law’s house, or I’m eating out at a bunch of restaurants with family and friends who are in town, or I’m going to holiday parties and I’m just not in control of anything. I just can’t control what my mother-in-law purchases or what people order for appetizers at the restaurant.”

And if you feel out of control, things will spiral. Nobody likes to feel out of control. And so we’ve been flipping the script and you mentioned stories. I love to bring that in, this idea of we tell ourselves these stories. So first pausing and if you have this feeling of, well, I’m going to a restaurant, I’m completely out of control, ask yourself, is that true, actually? Is that story that you’re telling yourself, and I tell myself stories as well, is that true? And then if you really think about it, you think, no. Actually, that’s not true. I’m not completely out of control. I can control how much water I have.

I can control what I order as my entree. I can control how much of my entree I eat, I can control how much of the appetizers I put on a small plate. I can control whether I order my own dessert or whether I share and have a couple of bites with someone else. I can control if I order alcohol or not. If you just focus on everything you can control, then the script flips and all of a sudden you go into these situations and you think, okay, you know what? Throw anything at me because no matter what comes my way, I can always find several dozens of factors I’m in control of. And so I’m going to focus on those. And it just makes it so much easier to navigate life feeling like no matter what, I can control at least 12 factors, well say at least a dozen. And you just, talk about feeling empowered, you feel like, put me on any vacation, put me in anyone’s house, I can control certain things.

Paul Salter:

I love that, such a great answer. And I can tell you one of the questions I ask every single person I’m having a conversation with, whether it’s for coaching or joining the 5% community, it’s using adjectives only, what are the two to three feelings that you want to feel on a regular basis? The first most popular one is confidence, and the second one is control. We want this sense of control. And of course some of us are on the other end of the spectrum where we need to control everything. But at the end of the day, we all possess some level of control of our lives. That autonomy and ability to influence an outcome in our favor is so powerful and empowering and something we all seek.

Brooke Simonson:

And I think diets have robbed us of feeling that because usually we’re following some external set of rules. And so it feels like the diet is controlling what we’re eating or not eating. We’re not really in control. And so if you just again, flip the script and realize you can control so many things and it doesn’t have to be all or nothing, something as simple as, like I said earlier, just controlling whether or not you have protein. And I was talking to a client the other day who travels for work a lot. And I was saying, if you were to just when you’re traveling, if you’re tracking calories at the time, you don’t want to track calories when you’re traveling. What if in any situation you just thought, okay, I’m going to get some protein, some produce and water, just your whole trip. Just can I get protein, produce and water? And she came back and she’s like, I’ve never felt better. I just felt like I was so in control because it was so simple.

Paul Salter:

Yeah, beautiful to hear. So I read, I don’t remember where I read it, on your website or on your social media when I was doing my deep dive stalking preparation work and you said sustainable weight loss requires releasing the mental weight of past dieting attempts. I love this. Tell me more about it.

Brooke Simonson:

That’s another conversation I’ve been having a lot recently. I’m sure you probably also get so much of your content from conversations, right? Because-

Paul Salter:

Yeah, yeah.

Brooke Simonson:

… you’re in a conversation with somebody and you think, oh my gosh, and I’m so inspired by the people I work with. I learn so much from them, I have to say. But in a call with a client, we were talking about the holidays coming up again, we’re recording this in December before most of the holidays have happened that people celebrate. And she was saying, “I don’t really feel like I want to focus on losing weight throughout the holidays. I’m fine maintaining my weight, but I don’t want to lose momentum.”

And I said, “Yes, to lose weight physically, you would have to be in a calorie deficit and that could be more challenging in the holidays. And kudos to you for having the self-awareness that maybe you don’t want that to be a priority right now. But to not lose momentum, we could just focus on having you release a lot of the mental weight of what you felt in past holiday seasons when you’ve been on certain diets. And then you feel like you’re still working towards this goal, but you’re doing the tough work of releasing the guilt or shame after having the cookies at the holiday party or the diet starts Monday, or I’m going to gain so much weight in December or whatever. All of the mental weight that you’ve had in past holiday seasons or on different diets.”

That’s hard work too and I would say even harder sometimes than the physical actions you can take of going for a walk or boiling a pot of eggs. The mental weight can be the toughest to lose and it takes time. Again, it doesn’t happen overnight and it takes conversations and a community of support often, but it can happen eventually. And that is almost the most freeing, I would say. I have clients say to me, “Even if I didn’t lose a single pound more, I just feel so much better. I feel like I’m eating a ‘normal’ person,” I hear a lot and I’m using normal in quotes again. But I feel like I can eat a ‘normal’ person. I can enjoy a treat and not completely spiral out of control. I just feel happier, I feel lighter, I feel more confident. And so the mental weight cannot be overlooked in a sustainable weight loss journey.

Paul Salter:

Yeah, that emotional baggage becomes heavier and heavier the more we ignore it or pretend it doesn’t exist. And we both know there’s ample research to show when we have all this chronic stress and if we think of emotion as just energy in motion and we don’t address it gets literally trapped and repressed in our body. And it comes back to rear its ugly head in some way, shape or form. Self-sabotaging behaviors, chronic illness, stress, whatever it may be.

Brooke Simonson:

Yeah, 100%, I couldn’t have said it better. You summarized it right there in 20 seconds perfectly.

Paul Salter:

You set me up with a softball, easy to hit it out of the park. So we each work with a lot of people who more or less might describe themselves as professional dieters. They’re really good at losing weight. So more often than not, there’s no shortage of knowledge of what to do, it’s the action. And we both talked about this earlier, having some accountability coaching community to get consistent action is integral to sustainable success. But my question for you is why is long-term consistency so hard?

Brooke Simonson:

Woo, coming in with the doozies today, huh, Paul? Why is long-term consistency so hard? I would say one thing I tell clients all the time is if you had to find a ‘magic pill’, and again, I put magic pill in quotation marks because it’s not a physical pill you would take, it’s not a supplement, it’s not a fat burning whatever. The magic pill really is consistent action and patience and you have to be patient. And so I think often people are on the right track, taking the right actions, but possibly the way they’re measuring progress is convincing them that they’re not seeing enough results and then they give up on the actions that would lead to awesome progress down the road. So patience is key. And I also think having a realistic view of what healthy, gradual sustainable weight loss looks like is very important. So I have a client right now who came to me, all of her friends decided to do Optavia or Optavia, I still don’t even know how you say it.

Paul Salter:

Yeah, as you say that, me neither.

Brooke Simonson:

I’ve heard it both ways, I have no idea. But it’s the bars and the shakes and the meal replacement, whatever. And so her friends are posting their results just on Facebook. I think they’ve decided to all share the results. So she’s seeing these all the time and they’re losing crazy amounts of weight per week because they’re barely eating anything and they’re not eating real food. They’re eating these bars and shakes. And so they’re maybe losing, at the start three, four pounds a week, which is possibly a lot of water weight, likely. And then after that, they’re going to two pounds a week and then she’s here working with me, losing a half pound to a pound per week. And it feels frustrating to her. And we have a lot of conversations about this.

But my thought I throw at her is always, what next for them? What are they going to do when they stop the bars and shakes? I’m not wishing ill upon anyone. If they can lose the weight and keep it off, more power to them. But are they at the same time, doing the mental work? Are they putting the sustainable habits into place like you are? And just when you’re trying to do the sustainable journey and you’re seeing all of these fast results around you, I think that can make it very hard to stay consistent with what I call the boring stuff, which is going for a walk, going to bed a little bit earlier, eating the protein, eating the fruits and veggies. It’s the boring stuff that is required that you do day in, day out and it will get you the long-term results. But the shiny object syndrome, I get it, it can be so tempting.

Paul Salter:

Yeah, and this is how I know where this conversation was meant to be. Literally my two steps to add was like long-term consistency or success are just fucking boring. You got to fall in love with monotony, yes. And I love your inclusion of shiny object syndrome, I use that all the time. I’ve fallen victim to that many, many times. But at the end of the day, dieting is sexy, weight maintenance is about as boring as it gets. If you told me that I could go weigh the same thing plus or minus a couple pounds for the rest of my life, or I could go on this roller coaster of lose 20, gain 18, lose 15, gain 20, I’d probably sign me up for the roller coaster.

Brooke Simonson:

For sure. And I had another client and he just kept saying, we were maybe on our eighth call and he kept saying, “Okay, but what is the weight loss recipe? What is the food recipe that I need to be following, the nutrition, exactly what to do?” And I’m like, “We’ve covered it. We’ve talked about it. It’s getting the protein, getting the fruits and vegetables, stay hydrated, get enough fiber.” And then the next call would be like, “Okay, but what is it?” He kept thinking I was holding out on him and I was just going to somehow drop this really sexy, magical equation.

And I was like, “I promise you, I’m not holding anything back from you. We’ve talked about it and I know you want another answer. I wish I had a magic wand, but it’s the boring stuff day in, day out.” And that’s a tough pill to swallow sometimes when you’ve been doing all the sexy stuff and getting these crazy results, it’s not easy to stay consistent with the boring stuff. But on the flip side, if you’re always looking at the glass half full approach, that’s really great news that you can do simple behaviors and see awesome results long term and that you don’t have to do these crazy roller coastery things that other people are doing.

Paul Salter:

Yeah, I think it’s important to just reiterate too, that this principle of falling in love with monotony on your success journey is applicable to every area of life. You go interview the wealthiest men and women in the world, they’re going to tell you to spend less than you make, they’re going to tell you to budget. And you’re going to be like, “Okay, but tell me more. Where’s the sexy secret?” No, they just do the same simple shit over and over for years, they let compound interest work for them. Same thing in building a healthy marriage or relationship, doing the little things over and over every single day, even when you don’t feel like it. It’s the boring stuff that gets you that ultimate level of pleasure and fulfillment.

Brooke Simonson:

And I think those are two great analogies to use, especially the marriage one. With weight loss, I feel like people often think, okay, I’m going to hit a point when I’ve just made it and all of a sudden I will have lost the weight and it’ll just stay off forever. And I use the marriage analogy of have you ever hit a point in your marriage or relationship with anyone where all of a sudden you’ve just peaked and it’s smooth sailing from there on out and you never have to work on anything again. And it seems crazy if you think about it in that term, but that’s what we expect from weight loss, that it’s just going to come off and stay off forever, magically.

Paul Salter:

If only.

Brooke Simonson:

If only, no. I’m sure you also wish on multiple occasions that you had that magic wand. If somebody invents it, then I want to be the first one to have it.

Paul Salter:

So let us end this wonderful conversation with this question. Someone listening right now is thoroughly enjoying what you’re sharing. And like many of the people they work with, they’ve been stuck in this weight loss regain cycle for years, maybe decades. They have a nasty, guilt-fueled relationship with food. What is one tiny step you would encourage them to take to start feeling better?

Brooke Simonson:

I would, going back to what we said, because you mentioned the guilt, shame thing. I would say just work on taking the good and bad language out of food like we had discussed. Just think of foods on a continuum, of they either have more nutrients or less nutrients. No food is good or bad, and you want to eat foods with more nutrients most of the time. And you then can allow the foods with less nutrients to fit in here and there around the edges. And if you just practice that, the second you catch yourself, oh, I want this cupcake but it’s bad, or I shouldn’t, or it’s not part of my diet, just stop yourself and think this cupcake is less nutritious, but no sweat. I can have it. And I have so many more nutritious foods I can eat later today to balance it out.

Paul Salter:

Yeah, I like that because when you make your food emotionally neutral, you also take out the emotion and how you’re speaking to yourself. So at least changing it from negative self-talk to at least neutral, if not maybe borderline positive. And that has a wonderfully positive ripple effect on how you speak to yourself, what you believe to be true, the actions you take, the results you get, the identity you achieve. So a wonderful carryover effect. Great, great action step. Brooke, where can people go connect with you, learn more about you and learn how to work with you?

Brooke Simonson:

My website is thehealthinvestment.com and from there you can learn about my programs. I have a group and a one-on-one coaching program and a podcast. So you can find all of those there. And then I am also active on Instagram at thehealthinvestment and TikTok newly this year also at thehealthinvestment. Yeah, TikTok is a whole other world.

Paul Salter:

It’s so funny you mentioned that. So I actually did a lot of research on jumping on TikTok and I’ve never had the app before. So I did a lot of research before even getting the app, I would only browse on my desktop, studying other people, what they were doing, what was working. And then I opened the app for the first time and the first video I saw was what looked like to be a homeless man with a pet squirrel on a leash. And I was immediately hooked. 20 minutes later, I’ve watched 1,000 videos. I was like, there’s no way I can use this for business purposes. I will be way too distracted. I haven’t been back on since.

Brooke Simonson:

It is really funny too that I wonder what about the algorithm thought that was the best first video to show you to suck you in.

Paul Salter:

Yeah, yeah, they’re wicked smart. They know something about myself I don’t know. Maybe I have a soft spot for squirrels, I’m not sure.

Brooke Simonson:

Gee, maybe.

Paul Salter:

It explains a lot. My dog chases them all the time, maybe that is what it is.

Brooke Simonson:

Right, and then if we went down the rabbit hole of I’m sure they do have some type of info on something you’ve said or some ad you’ve clicked on. But they know, I’m going to show you the squirrel video and we will have you sucked into this for life.

Paul Salter:

Yeah. Well they nailed it. They knocked it out of the park because yeah, I wasted 20 minutes of my… Actually, I wouldn’t even say I wasted it, it was enjoyable, but I-

Brooke Simonson:

It was enjoyable. Yeah, yeah, for sure.

Paul Salter:

Awesome. Brooke, well thank you so much for coming on today. I really enjoyed our conversation.

Brooke Simonson:

I so enjoyed reconnecting with you, Paul. Thank you so much.

Paul Salter:

Absolutely. And for those of you listening, thank you so much for being here. Go follow Brooke on Instagram, connect with her, check out her podcast, The Health Investment is a wonderful show and she interviews some damn smart, really cool, experienced people. So make sure you add that to your repertoire of weekly podcasts. And if you found today’s episode helpful, please go share it with a friend, family member or loved one who you know would also find it valuable. And if you haven’t already, 30 seconds to leave a genuine rating and review of the show of this particular episode would go a long way in helping get Brooke’s messaging as well as mine out into other people who truly need it, who need help getting out of that vicious yo-yo dieting cycle. Well, thank you again for listening. Have a wonderful rest of the day. And remember, screw the scale.